If a "later 60's 352", the HP will be way down as the 352 went to base engine status with the intro of the 390 (1961).

I would concentrate on the '59 352 for power rebuild.

Is money a big factor? If you start pricing parts/availability, you will find that 390 engine parts are a lot more available at much better prices. Looking at the engine, it's nearly identical to your 352. Perhaps the only telltale giveaway are more recent casting numbers.

I would find a good used 390 from a car or pickup truck and do a major overhaul on it. Pistons are cheaper, true roller timing chains are available and inexpensive, you can use aluminum Edelbrock heads (you can't on a 352), etc. I'm in the middle of this exact retrofit but I'm also using a roller cam and roller lifters. I'm building it for Bill Knighton in Australia. The reason for aluminum is because he lives in the Northwest Territory which is mostly desert and aluminum transfers heat four times faster than cast iron. Another reason for modern heads is, they're built for unleaded gas, using stainless valves, viton seals (oem (umbrella) seals are the worst), bronze guides and new springs.

I'm also building for tons of low-end torque since Squarebirds are better suited for cruising and luxury (rather than street racing). No more ZDDP issues, unleaded gas issues, or heat issues for this engine. It will run happily on modern oil and regular gas with LOTS more torque and ponies, than the 352 it is replacing. It's also much lighter with the aluminum heads and intake manifold. - Dave

On a side note ...

I just dropped two blocks off to my machinist in Denver and while roller cams do have fewer issues than flat tappet cams he is suggesting that you still run a zzdp additive in any performance oriented engine build. And here I thought I was off the hook. Mike

Mike, during all this heat and fire storms, I've been concerned about you and your place. I hope you're out of harms way.

ZDDP, I wonder why, Mike.? As far as I know the only area that really needs zinc and phosphorous is the cam lobes & lifter faces. Did your man say where else? I'm sure you're running a roller chain so that can't be a critical area. All the other bearing surfaces use soft & hard materials combination, or they are bathed in oil. - Dave

Thanks for the comments, guys!

Money is not an issue...well within reason. My 352 is running and in great shape so I'd hate to ditch it for something really similar. I get the point about the 390. That may be the direction I want to go! I'm all game about the alum heads and manifolds..although I guess I was wrong that I could do it with my 352.

The other question would be torque and tuning. I wouldn't want to race it but I'd like to have something with a little more power while being updated with heads and manifolds and other parts. I'm pretty new at this so sorry about all the questions!

Thanks!

-D

Torque comes from your cam. Get one with 260-270* total duration at .5" lift. Then advance your cam ~4* for low end stump-pulling torque. If you go with aluminum, you can advance your spark timing, 36* total advance @ 2,500 rpm. Use name-brand parts and a good 'true roller' timing chain. Keep your compression ratio around 9:1 and you should be good to go. - Dave

Interesting Discussion-

Sourced- http://www.barsproducts.com/blog/the...zinc-additives

Cost Consideration Cyl Head Rebuild-



There are also crankshaft kits and reman connecting rods available @ a fair price. The early 352 blocks can usually accept a heavy overbore (sonic check first) and a set of pistons and cam kit can make for a very cheap and power overhaul.

My biggest concern would be the cast log exhaust manifolds. They are very constrictive.

I totally agree. This is all about upgrading an old engine into a powerplant using modern methods and components. Back in the Squarebirds day, Ford didn't have aluminum heads, roller timing chains, roller cams, etc. FE's are good production engines that Ford produced as cheaply as possible and they were engineered to operate with gasoline and oil standards readily available that time. All of that has changed due to many reformulations over fifty years.

I read the Car Craft article, but I was looking for the rest of it. The article left out a whole lot. Generally, they took a Chrysler 318 set of c.i. heads, did a valve job, and decked the mating surfaces for a cost of over $300. They did not insert hardened seats or stainless valves. Heads need the valve stem towers machined to accept viton seals.

Heads area major part of any engine and machining costs are very high. NEVER go cheap on heads, but investing a lot of machining cost in oem heads just doesn't make sense if new aluminum heads are available for $1,500/pr. Resale on cast iron heads is only ~$200. Resale on aluminum heads is about $800 or more. Considering the many functional advantages aluminum offers, I will never go back to cast iron when aluminum is available at a reasonable cost.

I always ask myself, 'what do modern engines use?' They last 200,000 miles on unleaded gas and conventional dino oil. - Dave

Thanks for your concern ...

So far so good as far as the fires are concerned. We have had a lot of smoke and a few small fires near by, but nothing like the eastern slope. It is very dry here and there is a total fire ban in our county. I have to go back to Denver to drop off a couple of flywheels I forgot to take with me so I will quiz Rob on the zddp issue when I see him and let you know. I know he mentioned some sort of failure but my CRS disease seems to have misfiled the pertinent info. Mike

My wife says she suffers from MY CRS disease. I'm still in total denial.

Ok. I found a 390 that I'm interested in that is local. The one question that I have is about checking to see if it IS in fact a 390 that is being sold to me. I know many have asked this question but I was wondering what a good way to check for this? The engine is out of the car and I can inspect everything later on today or tomorrow. What tools will I need?


Thanks guys!

David

Dave, this is easy. The difference between a 352 and 390 is 1/4" more stroke. The 352 stroke is 3-1/2". The 390 stroke is 3-3/4".

Remember, Ford numbers their cylinders starting on the RH (passenger's) side starting front-to-back (1,2,3,4) Put the crank damper on TDC. Pull #1 & #4 plugs out and mark the depths with a welding rod down the plug holes. I use a Sharpie marker at the valve cover flange. When #1 is up (TDC), #4 is down (BDC).

Accuracy isn't critical. If the distance between your marks is 3.5", you have a 352. If the distance is 3.75" between your marks, that proves the crank has a 390/427 stroke.

As a side note: If you can't read the timing marks, simply put the welding rod in #1 spark plug hole and rotate the crank slowly. When it comes all the way up, stop. - Dave Dare

Dave,

Thanks for the info!! The person that was going to sell the engine to me isn't getting back to me so I'm not sure if the sale is going to happen. I guess the search continues!

I have a few question while i'm at it though. When you say "put the crank damper on TDC" and "BCD", what does that mean? And how do I do that? by hand?

also, how do I mark it at the valve cover flange and where is that?

Thank you again,

David